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March 7, 2008

Apex/Attak Owners Survey

Folks, I have designed a survey specifically for the owners of Apex and Attak models. I am hoping you will click on the link and give me your honest answers to the questions. I will be analyzing your responses and presenting to our product planning and engineering people. If you own an Apex Mountain or MTX model please do not complete the survey. We will cover the specific needs of the mountain market in another separate survey to ensure both markets have their specialized needs defined.

If you do not currently own an Apex or Attak please do not click the link as you’ll skew our data.

Apex/Attak Owners Survey

Thanks in advance.

cr

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Posted @ 4:21 pm in Sled Development,Yamaha People and Communication   

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29 Responses to “Apex/Attak Owners Survey”

  1. Larry D Lagergren says:

    Well; I like to see these survey’s as Yamaha gets to see 1st hand what the owners of these sleds are looking for in that sled. I have to admit though on my 08 Apex LTX GT other than changing the ski’s & carbides man this thing is one SWEET RIDE. Of course it took a few times out to dial it in to my liking, but so does every sled I buy. This is the 1st Yamaha that I’m very please with the rear skid set up as it really works well for me. With the new skis and the shocks dialed in everything seems to have a nice balance to it, and this sled is just a Dream to drive. As a Performance Buff i would love to see this sled in the 190HP N.A.Range, as I feel it’s just begging for it and that Motor Has It To Give.

    Can’t wait to see the 09 line up in April here as always Yamaha will have something for everyone.

    …..Larry

  2. Clint says:

    I would assume from this blog that we are not getting our improved Apex?

    Of course we are… it just depends on when and how you define improved 🙂 cr

  3. Darren says:

    I’m hopping this is for the 3rd generation Apex due in say 2012 ???

    Because were going to see the 2nd generation Apex next week (2009)…..YES…right…????

  4. Clint says:

    Kudos on the response to my previous post:)

    Here is my two cents from a seasoned marketer prespective. It seems to me that yamaha is not looking at this segment analysis from a niche perspective. I admit you have effectively carved out the four stroke niche allowing your entire model line to hold a higher show room value, but it seems the big Y lags on the next level of segmentation. Granted mass producing a true R version of an Apex like sled is not realistic, but I wonder if you have done margin analysis on charging another 3-4k USD for the R version. I know 500-1000 of these units would sell a year especially with the increased longevity of the 4 stroke. I know some people would gasp, but if the R had the following capabilities in this sequence they would sell.
    1. Always the engine leader {which lets face it Yamaha should be able to close their eyes and do this unless Honda enters) Supercharger may not be needed, but it certainly impassions R version.
    2. New skis I think that one is obvious.
    3. Rider forward, but not to far that it loeses guys like Dad who are nearing sixty, but still think they are mid-30’s. I think a taller seat is the answer.
    4. Rear Suspension is almost perfect some like it stiffer others want it soft but its close even the magazines agree. Maybe the R has a multi-spring multivariable shock.
    5. Front suspension works great but should probably move to the next level like the nytro
    6. Suck in the body panels and cut the weight like the nytro. People might talk about wind protection, but these guys will put winshields on if they want them.

    The thing to remember is this buyer doesn’t care about the cash they want one of two things either the performance, or the ability to walk out of the bar and say they are putting their butt on the baddest thing in the parking lot. I wold also ask the question has Yamaha looked at a Race shop model were a separate entity could be given a license to produce the R version. I know one subject that comes up is liability in regards to producing high HP sleds, but how can this be a factor if road bikes produce well over anything a snowmobile is currently producing. If it came to that the legal department could produce a liability waiver upon purchase. I know that some experimental aircraft companies do this.

    Just my two cents! I can’t wait to see the reply.

    Thanks Kent, the idea of a limited build ‘R’ model has been presented on several occasions over the years but never seems to get traction. We all understand the concept of a ‘no holds barred’ machine with a premium price tag. I think the most likely place to start would be in the mountain market then move some of the performance tech onto the trail. I think most of the actual suggestions you made could (and should) be integrated into a production model. What we need to do on a much broader scale is clearly describe the model concept and positioning, then let the engineers decide how best to design a sled to fit it. I’ll make sure the boys read your comments… well done… cheers cr

  5. Clint says:

    I also wanted to add this from a MR perspective:

    Who really test the sleds (Engineers) Somebody in Alaska 5000 miles from the largest market. I think you could find some guys that ride more miles than most people dream of. I know there are a few that still can really ride miles and fast. I see a couple per year. Dealers know these guys. If you had a test platform and secrecy agreement in place they could give you real world trail feedback 2-3years in advance. This would take out internal bias that stems from somebodies pet project getting squashed. Nobody on the trail looks if its in sheeps clothing.

    It would take me a complete post to address this one… we do have some special testing done by select dealers / customers but generally through our service department using pre-production sleds within a year of production. I have attended advance testing sessions all over the place, Japan, Sweden, Canadian Arctic, Alaska and New Zealand to name a few, I expect Russia will be next! It does happen.. cheers cr

  6. brian w says:

    Awsome questions..

    They are the type of questions yamaha should be asking after every year on a model.. (or they could just hire me to ride them) LOL

    Great job!!!!

  7. Kim says:

    Kim
    Thanks for the chance to do the survey. Can’t wait to see the rest of the line up. Put a turbo on an xtx nytro; that might be AWSOME. I am sure you are sick of everybodies dumb ideas. Oh yeah sign me up as a high mileage test pilot. I’ll take care of the expenses. In my dreams.

    No dumb ideas in my books (however some are less attractive than others 😉 ). I’ll add your name to list of volunteers! cheers cr

  8. Daranello says:

    I’ll be test pilot…heck, I’d pay Yamaha to be a test pilot….I’ll even pay for my own Gas and food and Transportation!

  9. john g says:

    I will be replacing the apex next year but if the skid and fuel range and weight are not addressed I will be forced to look elsewhere
    doesnt 07 rtx have torsion spring skid?
    maybe i would buy that one since it still has the “larger” gas tank, although a 100 hp phazer would be great also

    John, the RTX does have the torsion skid plus the suspension calibration on both suspensions is evolving steadily with different calibrations each season. All Apex run the same gas tank, there is no large weight difference planned but engineering is always tweaking things. cheers cr

  10. Len Svajlenko says:

    I have an ATTAK and am trying to do your survey but for some reason the “improvement priorities’ area will not accept more than one check mark in one column….

  11. Len Svajlenko says:

    Not sure if my comment go through but I’m tryint to do the ATTAK survey and it will not accept more than one check mark in one column.

    Hey Len, the first question is designed to force a ranking, for example; it would be of little use if you were able to rank everything as very important. We wish to know which items are of most (and least) importance to the majority. Thanks cr

  12. Mike W. (Tork) says:

    Keepin it real and realistic.
    I’d like 165-170 HP, EPS (electronic power steering) less hunting and darting and improved MPG.
    Very well written survey btw.. 🙂

  13. Superman says:

    Keep up the good work Chris and put the pedal to the metal. Excellent survey. I also like the ability to check an answer and then comment on some questions. Very nice touch.

  14. Clint says:

    I wanted to know if there is a way for a person to share some design elements with yamaha engineers. I am not sure how that collaboration would work.

    Clint, sharing design ideas with YMC is very dicey… we have very strict rules to follow on this one. Think about it, if someone had an idea which had a patent (our even if it didn’t) and we were working on a similar idea and were told about it… it could be construed that we stole the design and infringed the patent where we were really already there are on our own. You would need to send a letter to our customer relations department where they would forward to the appropriate people. cr

  15. WILLIAM CROWE says:

    I HAVE 07 ATTAK HANDWAMERS TO COLD LIGHTS AGG. WORK VERRY BAD

  16. Doogs says:

    You should re-release the survey about the FX Nytro. Now that I have some kms on it, I’d like a chance to let Yamaha know what I think about that lemon. Thanks.

    You sure know how to persuade a fella doogsy!

  17. sj@T.Y. says:

    Almost every snowmobiler with any serious experience knows yamaha builds the best motors…in the effort to bring fourstrokes to the forefront..I think you guys have dropped a bit in durability and of the rest of the sled.Obviously it is of great expense to have been cuttin edge in this class and some other minor failings have shown through..handwarmers of less than the legendary yamaha standard..poor hyfax wear..a bad batch of wheels etc….but most important….the problem at the titanium “y” headers connecting to the intermediate pipe…the fiberous? dunut wears easily and can cause the exhaust to leak and worse yet the clamps to rattle which left unattended will rapidly saw away at the header with disasterous results..

    I believe Yamaha should step up and look for a permanent solution to this problem..
    I have a very spefic idea on a retrofit

    I think Yamaha is a class leader and can prove it by solving shortcomings found later even if it requires some customer investment down the road..

    Thanks SJ, the exhaust header issue has become more clear to us this season, I assume this is the result of many more sleds getting into the higher mileage category. The best I can say is make sure your dealer logs your complaint with our service department. The more cases on file the more likely it is for us to react. We are re-focusing on our QDR (quality, durability and reliability) which will take some manpower away from new model development which I believe is a good investment in our future (as much as I like to see benchmark setting new models every year.)
    cheers cr

  18. shawn whalen says:

    I love my 06 Attak and would buy another one if anything happened to this one. My comment is to the OE setup. It took me alot of reading on TY to figure out how to make this ride and handle the way it should have from the factory. I was told it was set up for my weight and riding stle from the dealer. not so!! i know this is still the problem as my buddy bought an 08 vector on the Friday from a different dealer with the same crummy set up. – too much transfer no steering and too stiff rear suspension. Maybe you guys could update the dealers on proper setup to make that initial ride more satisfying. I almost forgot I rode a bunch of 08 at a Yamaha demo days event and the best handling sled of all was the territory reps personal ride. Why?? because he has been riding it all year and set it up while the rest were still at factory set up mode. Sorry to ramble – not bad that this my only complaint (other then hand warmers). Love the blog!!!!!

    Thanks Shawn, not meaning to sound defensive when I say the factory suspension set-up should be considered a ‘ball-park’ spec. There is no doubt that some basic tuning will help dial it in for many and some advanced tuning and specialized parts can make a big difference. Our guys are challenged to find a spec that works great for a huge number of rider /
    terrain combinations. That said we have changed calibration every year on most models trying to get the ride closer to home plate for many. cheers cr

  19. James Stormont says:

    I owened my 2006 APEX for 1 season and really enjoyed it. I live on Georgian Bay and ride snow-ice lakes every day in Canada.Overheating,loss of sliders and wheels at 200 miles told me this is a trail machine vs lake sled.This prevented me from further enjoying the long trips.

  20. sledfreak says:

    Cris, Love my 06 Apex GT… I will try a 136″ sled for my next sled or a tipped 144 if it’s available in a Apex type motor, but I would like to re-iterate what Tork said. That’s what I want for my next sled.

    Sledfreak from TY…

    keep the faith! cr

  21. Yellowknife says:

    Interesting comments.

    I agree that the handwarmers need to be warmer. I also found it interesting that while reading a mag, they said Yamaha’s handwarmers are the only ones that require you to take your eyes off the trail to adjust. I never thought of that before…you glance down to look at speeds and other info just the same, but maybe its more-so the cycling of the heat level that takes too much time. Make the switch an up/down like it used to be, and offer a push button like the high beam that selects between the thumb and hands, or cut the range of heat adjustability down to half so it doesn’t take 9 button pushes to cycle through it. Make those temps melt the bars for us in the north 😉

    Re: Tork’s comment, I’d be willing to bet EPS will find its way into a Yamaha Grizz, I mean Nytro.

    Re: testing sleds – that would be great if you could comment further on it sometime Chris. All of us think we’d be better testers and that we have the best conditions for the testing (me included) so I’m very curious about it.

    Cheers,
    YK

  22. Derek O'Brien says:

    hello, i am from Labrador and i own a 2007 attak gt and up to this point i have been fairly satisfied. but i have to admit that i am getting disappointed….at full power my machine is awesome….the best experience ever….but i am not gettin the best experience. I bought it last year in october after i booked it in april 2006. Since then, ive had a vlave ed, i had over heating problems, the attak gt is burning oil, my shock collapsed and prior to that it was bottoming out which i figured out was a set up problem relating to another message i read on this comment page, and now my attak gt idles at different speeds and its sound is muffeled and ily. right now, i have 4 things on my work order that need checking and i relly like yamahas and driving them…im writing this letter in hopes that these problems will be checked in future so that this can be avoided. I’ve driving yamahas all my life and i have all good machines but i have to be honest in saying that this is the most trouble ive had. i have a new electric system coming for my shock, and the local yamaha dealer is taking a look at my oil and that weird sound….but i just want to address the fact that i am having these problems and see if something can be done about them. On another note i have to say that i am getting complete satisfaction from my yamaha dealer and yamahas warranty. this letter is simply a heads up and some problems my model is having….well thats all.

    P.S. this sled talk site is pretty cool….keep it going

    Thanks Derek, the shock issue is known and generally related to ice build-up in the skid, I am more concerned with your engine. Obviously something is not right. We are here to take care of you, and help is only a phone call away for your dealer. The best thing you can do is communicate as accurately as possible with your dealer regarding riding conditions, mechanical symptoms and history etc… the better the info the easier the diagnosis. cheers cr

  23. Derek says:

    hey, im just wondering about somethng on my machine. when you first start an attak gt when the engine is cold, you have to turn the key ce the let the dash light up and for enjection to occur. but, my question is, if the engine is already warmed up, do you have to turn the key to allow enjection to occur, or can you turn the key on right away starting the engine and skipping the dash light up and enjection? is that possible. really appreciate an answer, thanks

    Derek, the system is basically fool-proof, the sound you hear when first turning the key is the fuel pump which is pressurizing the system, the warning light lets you know you are not going anywhere until the engine is warmed up (to prevent damage), once warmed up you can drive it like you stole it… just turn the key straight to ignition and go… cheers cr

  24. sledfreak says:

    What happened here, did they lose the results to the survey?

  25. sledfreak says:

    Please Chris say something about the 2010 lineup. This is very frustrating. I’m going on 5 years on the same sled.

  26. Richard says:

    Hey

    I just bought a 2006 Apex Gt and I cannot adjust the rear shock by pressing the mode button and by operating the grip warmer toggle switch. The only way that I can adjust it is by turning on the key and quickly operating the warmer toggle switch when I see the shock being displayed, after that I can’t seem to adjust it. Am I doing something wrong? or is there a problem with the machine?

    The machine has to be running, you use the mode switch to select either the shock or grips, one you select the mode it should remain in that mode and allow you to adjust the selected item at any time. The adjustment is shown in bars on the display. The 06 did have a info bulletin on the wire where it connected to the shock, it could become damaged due to ice build-up, improper routing etc. cr

  27. yamahamer700 says:

    I have an ’07 Apex GT and can’t get it started. I started it yesterday and pulled it on the trailer. A few hours later, had to start it again to move it up in the trailer a bit. A while later took it to the trail and it wouldn’t start!!!! I turn the key to position 1, hear the feul pump and see the dash set. Then turn key to start and it just cranks and cranks. Eventually the battery gets weak. I left it set over night and tried again today and same thing. I noticed the warning light is on (bottom round light on right of dash) while I’m trying to start it. Any help????

    could be a ot of things but first place to look if I have to throw a dart is: spark plugs… They will foul if the unit is started and stopped frequently without being fully warmed up… cr

  28. yamahamer700 says:

    Yep. Problem solved. Changed the plugs and it runs like a champ. Thansk for the help. By the way … what a pain to change the plugs in this thing

  29. James Hill says:

    I own a2007 yamaha attak gt. It has a recurring probblem. On the three peice suspension the stabiliser bar that holds the third pice not a shock but looks like a shock but smaller the littler one th a t stops u from your track from going into t h e tunnle bottoming out on . I have snapped 4 going on fifth one. I dont know whythis is happenig ive taken it to many dealers they have never heard of this happening like it is to mine. Im not a huge person im 6 1 190lbs.im in shape dont beat the hell out of it only have 3, xxx miles on it. I get a new one and it will snap with in 3 hours of riding. The last one slamed threw my ripsaw track and put rips down the middle of track which is now junk. Has anyone hear of this or have a solution to my recurring problem. Ive purcased new suspension peices and had them installed and still is happening rails are straight any help or ideas will help thanks.


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